Where is the line?

[Olorin]

I never kiss anyone on the mouth, open or closed, except my wife. I don't even give them a peck on the cheek. For me, the most I will consider doing with another woman is the 'side' hug (i.e no touching of her breast to my chest).

[Ron]

I never kiss anyone on the mouth, open or closed, except my wife. I don't even give them a peck on the cheek. For me, the most I will consider doing with another woman is the 'side' hug (i.e no touching of her breast to my chest).

Same here.

[RuggedAmerican]

What crosses the line and is sexual?

Closed-mouth kissing? Open-mouth kissing? Fondling of breasts? Or genitals? Something more?

If it's arousing, it's sexual. So it could even be just a hug. I got hard from my now-wife hugging me after our second date. I'd say it's degrees of eroticism rather than a bright line, in my own experience.

[SLS]

If it's arousing, it's sexual. So it could even be just a hug. I got hard from my now-wife hugging me after our second date. I'd say it's degrees of eroticism rather than a bright line, in my own experience.

Indeed. DW and I had a boundary of not kissing before marriage so instead we would nuzzle each other. What we didn't realize until we were married was that, for us, nuzzling was just as arousing (if not more so) than kissing.

Like Rugged said it is a matter of degrees and of respecting boundaries in the heat of the moment rather than one bright red line that applies to all couples.

Sexual attraction and arousal should be expected in a romantic relationship. You are going to get aroused in certain situations when you are around your romantic partner.

The key in my mind is sticking to boundaries in the heat of the moment. Even though DW and I were aroused by nuzzling, we chose not to escalate things beyond what we had agreed.

[IndyDad]

Lol there can be so much arousal without crossing any physical line anyways, and at least for me it's dependent on my current mood and the situation as to what causes arousal/sexual desire. Sitting next to my husband and holding hands in church can make me aroused, so would that be the line?

A good conversation or hearing my husband sing a good song with his deep bass voice and looking at me when we were dating had me aroused - what then?

Kissing also did it, but so did a good hug when we just *really* liked each other.

We didn't cross the line of touching genitals or breasts prior to marriage and kept hands (mostly) above clothes, but both of us orgasmed on multiple occasions from kissing and our bodies pressed together. I drew the line at hands going onto genitals/under clothes because I was pretty sure if we went there we wouldn't stop anything else either. So for me that was the line; stop if it feels like you'll go further without meaning to/lose control.

Honestly when you're a horny teen/young adult it's hard *not* to deal with a lot of sexual arousal when the dating period is as long as it is in our culture. It's very difficult to identify a concrete line that's "do not cross" aside from "don't have sex."

I like how you say, you kept your hands mostly above clothes, and you probably mean over clothes as well. But from my experience as a teenager, girls were OK with fondling their breasts under their shirts, over the bras, and sometimes even their bare breasts.

[PaulB]

But from my experience as a teenager, girls were OK with fondling their breasts under their shirts, over the bras, and sometimes even their bare breasts.

In retrospect, I think "allowed" or "tolerated" would be more accurate than "OK with" some of the time.

[Carolina50]

Crossing the line for what? Becoming sexual? Being sinful?

I suppose, if we're talking folks not married to each other.

When we were dating DW drew the line at PIV sex.
This seemed like a pragmatic compromise between not doing sinful things and not being unbearably frustrated.
I think it was a reasonable idea in the sense that something decisive and irreversible happens after a couple has PIV sex; personally I always felt that until that point you can break up without spiritual consequences but once you have crossed that line, you have done something very serious.
So for us that was the line.
The fact that we were unable to stick to that principle is another matter.

Same for us and we dated six years… because we were both in agreement it was a solid boundary but we were allowed to at least express feelings without going crazy. No OS either

[Tantalum]

Crossing the line for what? Becoming sexual? Being sinful?

I suppose, if we're talking folks not married to each other.

When we were dating DW drew the line at PIV sex.
This seemed like a pragmatic compromise between not doing sinful things and not being unbearably frustrated.
I think it was a reasonable idea in the sense that something decisive and irreversible happens after a couple has PIV sex; personally I always felt that until that point you can break up without spiritual consequences but once you have crossed that line, you have done something very serious.
So for us that was the line.
The fact that we were unable to stick to that principle is another matter.

Same for us and we dated six years… because we were both in agreement it was a solid boundary but we were allowed to at least express feelings without going crazy. No OS either

Well, it’s a difficult question because on the one hand we were both against the idea of premarital sex on the basis that it encourages promiscuity but then we were also pragmatic enough to know that we had to do something to relieve the incredible tension. Getting all excited during a date and then going home and masturbating (let’s face it, that would have been the alternative) seemed a bit silly, especially as both DW and I were in our twenties when we met.
We didn’t really discuss this at the beginning, it just happened. As we were dating and became a bit “handsy” DW gradually allowed me to touch her and had an orgasm like that and then she asked me if she could do something for me in return, and we found the compromise of mutual HJ’s very satisfactory.
In hindsight I would say that one thing that was really good about it was that we got to know each other’s body really well. So for example I learned and accepted that DW needed clitoral play to reach orgasm, so even after we started having PIV, I knew that DW had to be taken care of in other ways too. For me personally it was a real relief to see that DW was comfortable the inevitable product of my orgasm, semen on her hands and body in general.
But having said that, enormous respect to couples who manage to keep themselves for their wedding night.